424 | The Fool and the King, Turning Pain into Praise, and Love Times Three with Tim Timberlake (Part 1)
Episode Description
What does it look like to father from love instead of frustration? In Part 1 of this two-part conversation, Pastor Tim Timberlake shares what it was like losing his dad the day after his 18th birthday—and how 24 years later, he’s still unpacking the treasures from their final conversation. Tim opens up about how his father’s tone, words, and presence shaped the man and dad he’s becoming today. Plus, he reveals the simple practice that keeps him anchored in gratitude and why every dad has both a fool and a king inside—and the one you address is the one that will respond. Stay tuned for Part 2 next week.
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Tim Timberlake is the Senior Pastor of Celebration Church in Jacksonville, Florida, and Christian Faith Center in Creedmoor, North Carolina. He’s the bestselling author of The Power of 1440 and The Art of Overcoming. Tim is a gifted communicator, thought leader, and sought-after speaker known for blending biblical truth with real-life wisdom. He and his wife, Jennifer, are the proud parents of their son, Maxwell. Tim’s father, the late Bishop Mack Timberlake, continues to shape his legacy as a father and pastor to this day.
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Legacy is not what you leave for your children—it’s what you leave in them. Frame it with your words and your presence.
Every dad has both a fool and a king inside, and the one you address in your kids is the one that will respond.
Don’t just turn your head toward your kids—turn your heart. Be where your feet are and be relational, not just transactional.
Pain will produce fruit if you stay in it long enough. Make it purposeful and turn it back into praise before it becomes pride.
If you don’t plan your celebrations, your defeats will plan themselves. Collect moments, not things.
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DADAWESOME Book:dadawesome.org/book
Subscribe to DadAwesome Messages: Text the word "Dad" to (651) 370-8618
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Jeff Zaugg: Welcome back to DadAwesome. Guys, this is Episode 424 and my name is Jeff Zaugg and my voice is gravel today. My voice, I'm like growling at you guys and it's because we launched our 2026 Team DadAwesome. Our activation event was this last weekend in Jacksonville, Florida and we had our team rally and do the six mile, 25 obstacle Spartan Challenge. Our team was incredible. There's some pictures on at DadAwesome on Instagram, check that out. But we raised funds for Fueling Fatherhood Ministry along with our partner organization, BraveCo, their Father-Son event. And man, we're so grateful. So came off that weekend of yelling, cheering. I did the Spartan Race twice over the weekend.
Today we have Pastor Tim Timberlake from Jacksonville, Florida. He pastors at Celebration Church. The first time I visited Celebration Church was like almost 20 years ago, but the team at Celebration has partnered with DadAwesome to take on the Spartan Challenge the past few years and we're so grateful for their team. They care deeply about fatherhood, about men's ministry.
But I want a quick shout out. Half of our giveaways are on the website right now. So the DadAwesome book is launching in 12 days and half of the freebies, the free giveaways, the sample chapter, the Bible reading plan, half of them are available now, 12 days out. The other half will come up next week. So you got to check out dadawesome.org/book. You can jump right in now and check out some of the free giveaways to celebrate the anticipation of the book launching on March 17th. So thank you for cheering. Thank you for pre-ordering. Thank you for checking out the giveaways. Thank you for sharing. Tuesday, March 17th is the day to share. So no reason to go on social media and start sharing now. Wait till then. But so grateful for you guys. So this is the first half of my conversation. I'm so grateful for this conversation with Pastor Tim Timberlake.
[CONVERSATION BEGINS]
Jeff Zaugg: Conversation finds us sitting in Jacksonville, Florida chatting with Pastor Tim Timberlake — a pastor, father, son, husband, leader, podcaster, author. What would your son Max add to or subtract from that list?
Tim Timberlake: I mean, to Max I'm just dad, you know, and that's the most beautiful title aside from husband. I think I steward. And so for me the way that I view who I am — I'm a son first, then I'm a husband, then I'm a father, then I'm a servant. And so when I look at it from that perspective, I understand my identity. I understand where my affirmation comes from. One of the most beautiful scriptures to me in all of the Word of God is when Jesus gets baptized and He comes out of the water, and scripture says from heaven, God speaks: "This is my son, who I am well pleased." And two things happen in that incredible statement. Number one, He gives Him His identity. And number two, He affirms Him. And I think when we as children know that the Father affirms us and we are made in His image and we have an opportunity to be in His likeness, that's one of the greatest things that we could ever do — is to become.
Jeff Zaugg: And it's a daily.
Tim Timberlake: Oh absolutely. Yeah, 100%.
Jeff Zaugg: I thought as a fun warm up — you're a basketball player, right?
Tim Timberlake: Yeah, I am.
Jeff Zaugg: We'll take a couple trips down the court. Now, I'm taller than you.
Tim Timberlake: Yes, you are.
Jeff Zaugg: I'm going to throw the alley-oops today. Can you throw it down?
Tim Timberlake: Absolutely.
Jeff Zaugg: So I'll throw the alley-oops with a theme and a scripture. And then it could be a sentence or a couple of minutes, whatever God stirs up for dads. So here's the first one. First theme, we go heavy right away. Here we go. Suffering is the theme. Romans 5:3 — "We rejoice in our sufferings, knowing that suffering produces endurance, and endurance produces character, and character produces hope, and hope does not put us to shame." What would you throw down?
Tim Timberlake: Yeah, I think for fathers, one of the greatest things that we can do is remain hopeful. Life is pressing in on us. Our kids talk to mom, mom talks to us. Who do we talk to? And a lot of times we suppress, we push down and we allow the pressures of life to remain dormant in us until one day they come to the surface. And so when we anchor our hope in Jesus Christ, it allows us to have some release, some output, some outlet that we normally would not have the opportunity to have. And so when we think about that hope having its way and working for us — it won't work until we work it. And so that's where I would leave Romans 5, man, for the fathers.
Jeff Zaugg: We'll take back to that, I'm sure. Here we go, next one. Generations. Deuteronomy 30:19 — "This day I've called heavens and earth as witnesses against you, that I've set before you life and death, blessings and curses. Now choose life so that you and your children may live."
Tim Timberlake: Absolutely. I think there's so much power in language. There's so much power in words. There's so much power in the tongue. And one of the greatest legacies we could leave for our children is perspective in language. And so the way I define legacy — legacy is not what I leave for someone. It's not what I leave for Max. It's what I leave in Max. And so I want him to carry the things that I carry. I want him to honor the things that I honor. And so that's impossible for him to do if I don't frame it with language, if I don't frame it with my words. And so utilizing those words and helping him to understand something that my father told me — it's a powerful statement that I carry to this day: every word is like a thousand pound weight. Be mindful of where you place it. And so making sure that he understands the significance of that, because words do carry power.
Jeff Zaugg: Whoa. I want to stay on it, but it's warm up, just the warm up. Here's the next alley-oop. Heart pursuit. Malachi 4:6 — "And he will turn the hearts of fathers to their children and the hearts of children to their fathers, lest I come and strike the land with a decree of utter destruction."
Tim Timberlake: Yeah. Oftentimes we turn our heads to our kids, but not our heart. And so, so often we are in a place, but our head is somewhere else. Our heart is somewhere else. We are there, but we're not really there. And so when I think about turning the hearts to the kids and the kids and their hearts to the fathers, I think about both being where their feet are. I think about being hyper aware of your surroundings. I think about being present. I think about being grounded and not just being transactional with your kids, but being relational. Being intentional. Not waiting for that day to come, but realizing that this is that day and that these days aren't promised. And so making sure you steward them well.
Jeff Zaugg: Thank you. We're on the fourth trip up the court. Gaze at God. And this is straight from your wife. She unpacked this in a message. Romans 8:18 — "I consider that our present sufferings are not worth comparing with the glory that will be revealed in us." And then she added the paraphrased version: "I am convinced that any suffering we endure is less than nothing compared to the magnitude of glory that is about to be unveiled within us." Gaze at God.
Tim Timberlake: And so when I'm doing my job — my job as a father is to do a couple of things. Number one, protect. Second thing is to provide. The third thing is to prophesy. And when I do those things with my head turned towards God, I become a shield for my family. And that's one of the greatest assignments that I think God could ever give us. And so I encourage our fathers that are listening right now — continue to gaze at God. There's a passage that I love. It says, "I look to the hills from which cometh my hope," because my hope comes from the Lord. Doesn't come from people, doesn't come from my job, doesn't come from my family — it comes from God. And when I get my help from God, then I can share help with my wife and with my son.
Jeff Zaugg: I just want to keep running this court up and down. Here is the fifth one though. Delayed dreams. Joel 2:28 — you actually partially already got after this — "I will pour out my spirit on all flesh. Your sons and daughters shall prophesy. Your old men shall dream dreams. And your young men shall see visions."
Tim Timberlake: Yeah, I think one of the most profound things about that text is how the Bible defines age. It doesn't define it by number. It defines it by if we're dreaming dreams or if we're having visions. And so no matter what season you're in as a father, whether you are still in the dream season or whether you're in the vision season, make sure you steward it well so that you can pass on what God is saying to the generation coming behind you.
Jeff Zaugg: What is the difference between a dream and a vision?
Tim Timberlake: A dream oftentimes comes when we're asleep. And I asked God one time, "Why do you speak to me when I'm asleep?" He said, "Because I know you won't interrupt me." And so God often speaks to us through dreams. A vision more so is an image that God plants into your spirit, your soul, your mind, that gives you a view of what He desires to do. And you don't have to be asleep for that. Sometimes you can be straight awake and see and get a picture, get an image of what it is that God desires, and it sears your soul and then you run with it.
Jeff Zaugg: Yeah, I think about the road to Emmaus — my heart's burning. Like it's that vision just seeping in. Okay, bonus, bonus trip down the court. Last one, and this one's not a scripture, it's a quote from St. Catherine of Siena. The theme is identity: "Be who God meant you to be and you will set the world on fire."
Tim Timberlake: Yeah. My desire as a son is to look more and more like my father. When you think about your kids, your girls — they have this innate feature to want to mimic mom and dad. And so no matter what they do, no matter what they try, no matter how much they try to avoid it, they will become more and more like you and your wife because they are in proximity of good leaders. And so when we are in proximity of God, the desire and by design, we are supposed to become more and more like Him. That is why in Genesis He says, "Let us make mankind in our image. Let us make them after our own likeness." Because we mimic our Maker. And that's a very beautiful thing and a very beautiful place to be. And so yes, when I am becoming who God designed for me to be, I set the world on fire.
Jeff Zaugg: So last week you took the week off, and I think I even heard from some of your team, "It's his birthday." But I knew that your birthday is significant because of your story. And it was — 24 years?
Tim Timberlake: 24 years, yeah. 24 years my dad has been going to Glory. And I think about him every single day and the significant impact that he's had, not just on my life, but on everyone that got an opportunity to hear him or to meet him. And not many places I go, still today 24 years later, that people aren't telling me, "Man, I watched your father on television. And this message, it brought me to the Lord." And "This message saved my marriage." And "This message restored my relationship with my kids." So it's a great heritage and legacy to be a part of.
Jeff Zaugg: Just you pausing though and taking some time off around your birthday for more than just celebrating you, because it's much more rich than that because of loss. My dad passed away a little over six years ago. I just wanted to learn from you for a moment on creating anchoring rhythms to give thanks, gratitude, but also — I think God still wants to teach me things from my dad. What are you learning in this space, 24 years after saying goodbye?
Tim Timberlake: Yeah, I think one of the greatest things that I could have ever learned is — your father, in most cases, whether our listeners have him in your life right now or at some point was in your life, and he may have been a terrible father and he may have been absent, but at his core, most of the time, that father wants you to do better than he did. And when you really think about it, the father is really the only male in your life that wants you to surpass him in everything.
And so for me, just taking moments to reflect on my father and the significant impact that he had on me and how his wisdom, knowledge, personality, his godly character, his integrity — it shaped me. It shaped the man that I am. It shaped the father that I am. And every opportunity I get to reflect on that and to be grateful for just the investment of life into my life, I want to honor that with time. It's okay to honor it with a thought. It's okay to honor it with a moment. But there's something valuable about honoring it with time. And I want to make sure I just set aside ample time to reflect and really think through — am I becoming the man that, number one, God wants me to become, and number two, my dad would want me to become.
Jeff Zaugg: Your dad's first name?
Tim Timberlake: Mack.
Jeff Zaugg: Did people in the community refer to him as Reverend Mack or Pastor?
Tim Timberlake: It just depended. I mean, he was many things to many different people. He led the state of North Carolina all four years in basketball. And so he was a basketball legend. He was a pastor to some, he was a teacher to other people. He taught in high school for many, many years. And so people knew him as different things. But if you were to say Mack Timberlake Jr., everybody in the community would know who you were talking about just because of the impact that he had.
Jeff Zaugg: So I have benefited from your dad. Because in my preparation for today's conversation — a handful of messages and podcast conversations and your two books — so I benefited from seeds that he planted. That in real time, when you said goodbye the day after your 18th birthday, he didn't see some of that fruit through you to me in Northeast Florida. What are a few things that you would just pick up like, "Yep, that's something that he deposited in me that now I'm bringing." Core passion, core areas of just your full heart. What are some things you're like, "Man, that's from my dad."
Tim Timberlake: Man, I think it would be a harder question to try to figure out what is actually not from my dad. Because there are just so many characteristics. People often ask me, "Why are you passionate? Why do you preach the way that you preach?" And it's for a couple of reasons. One of them — I've encountered and endured so much pain. And so I want pain to be purposeful in my life. We can all connect and identify with pain.
Number two, just the hardships and pain of my parents and seeing them steward integrity and the call of God and their gifts so well in hard seasons. My grandparents, the same thing. My grandfather was a pastor. And to see him and my grandmother in the worst season of their lives just steward their call so well and so integral and so much in tune with what God desired for them to do and who He desired for them to become beyond their comfort — it inspires me every single day.
And so my patience comes from my dad. My charisma characteristics come from my dad. The tone and the inflections and how I talk come from my dad. And when I look in the mirror now, I see my dad. I'm like, "Oh my gosh, who in the world am I?" And I haven't talked to him, I haven't seen him, I haven't hugged him, I haven't touched him in over 24 years. And no matter what I think I am becoming, I can listen to a tape and I say, "Man, I sound just like him."
So much so — I was back in North Carolina a couple of months ago at our church there. And one of our staff there was listening to a message and I walked by her cubicle and I said, "What message is that? I don't remember preaching that." She said, "No, this is Bishop." That's what they call my dad at church. And I was like, "Oh my gosh, it sounds just like me." And so it's just those type of things that remind me of how much I am like him and what an honor and a privilege.
Jeff Zaugg: You used the phrase "steward the calling." So thinking about me, my friends, the dads listening — these dads that have clearly a calling from God in fatherhood, in marriage, stewarding the calling, but yet bumping up against pain this quarter, this month, today, last year. I just feel like I'm in proximity to a lot more pain. The pressing in of like, "I'm going to steward this calling. I've been called to this. I have what I need for this. I'm not surprised by pain. This is a calling I'm going to give my full heart to." What would you just share around upstream sources so we can be that dad that brings our full heart? And then also just encouragement to that dad that's like, "Right now I'm hitting so much pain I can hardly even think about stewarding this calling. I'm just trying to survive."
Tim Timberlake: Yeah. A couple of things. The first thing is this — fight against getting what you want. And we really think about it as men. The reason we fall, the reason we fail, the reason we compromise is because we get what we want. That's why David said, "The Lord is my shepherd. I have no wants." And so if we get what we want, we jeopardize getting what we need. That's why in Philippians, scripture doesn't say, "And God shall supply all your wants according to His riches and glory through Christ Jesus." He says, "I'll supply your needs."
And so fight against getting what you want. And it's very easy to find what you want. But when you're in pain, you have to safeguard yourself. You have to provide protective barriers. You have to be accountable.
The second thing that I would say is — make the pain purposeful. Stay in it long enough for it to produce what God desires for it to produce. Paul said, "I asked God three times, remove this thorn from my flesh." And God says, "My grace is sufficient for you." And so if God won't remove it, that means God is moving something in you and He's producing something in you that cannot be produced any other way.
And so I would encourage our parents and specifically our fathers that are listening, that are leaning in — steward the pain well, because the pain will produce fruit if you stay in it long enough. And it will push you to become more like your Father. If Jesus could not escape pain and if Jesus had to endure pain, then we will have to endure it as well, with the hopes that we become more like Him in the process.
Jeff Zaugg: Are there any rhythms of the day or the week or the year that help anchor you back to — no, this is purposeful. I'm looking back now at a different vantage point. This is purposeful. Any things that you've just found helpful for you and maybe other dads that you've invested in?
Tim Timberlake: Yeah, I think anytime you take a moment to reflect — I encourage the man, like when you feel like pain is overwhelming, you just pull out your phone, go to your picture albums, look at your kids. That's a friendly reminder of, "Man, I'm called to steward this season well. And I'm called to steward these children well. I'm called to steward my marriage well."
And don't allow pain to speak for you. Don't allow pain to dictate your goals. Don't allow pain to decide your destiny. You make pain work for you. You make pain produce the fruit that God desires for it to produce. And it will get you into a place that only God can deliver you from. And when He does, man, give Him the glory.
Because anything — and this is what I've learned — any pain that has brought me into a season that God has delivered me from that I don't turn back into praise will eventually turn into pride. And I will think more about that season than I do God's provision in it. I'll think more about the pain in that season than God's purpose in it. And I'll think more about the problems of the season than God's promises.
And so just turn it back into praise. And take out time throughout the day. I have a notification on my phone three times a day — 7 a.m., 3 p.m., and then 10 p.m. — "Have you stopped to thank God for today?" Three times a day, just notifications on my phone, just friendly reminders. And the reason I do that is because if I don't plan my celebrations, my defeats will plan themselves.
Jeff Zaugg: Can you say that one more time?
Tim Timberlake: If I don't plan my celebrations, my defeats will plan themselves. And so I encourage the fathers, man, plan those celebrations. Collect memories, not things. Collect moments, not things. Because time is precious. It is one of the two things you can never get back. Can't get more dirt. Can't get more time. That's it.
Jeff Zaugg: So the time — I'm going back to you, the day of your 18th birthday, knowing that there was an extended conversation with your dad. And there was words, there was calling, there was deposits made in that moment. For the context of the dads listening, what are some treasures that are still being unpacked today as a dad of a nine-year-old? Just some treasures from him that you'd say, "I want to share this."
Tim Timberlake: I would say some of the greatest gold that I have gleaned from my dad is tone. I never heard him raise his voice. I never heard him yell. I never heard him speak from frustration or anger. His tone was just impeccable. And so when there was something that I did bad, and I did a lot of bad things, man, he would sit me down and his tone would be so loving that the love of my father would convict me into wanting to become better.
And so he would always sit me down and talk to me through love, not frustration. He would always demonstrate the Father's love through godly discipline. And he would always love me back into a place where I understood my place and my identity anchored in him. And I didn't have to work for his love. I didn't have to prove anything to receive his love. He gave it to me.
And so I think that's one of the greatest things, man — tone. And so I try to model that with my son. I don't raise my voice at him. We don't discipline him out of anger or frustration. Everything is done out of love, because it marked me and I know it's marking him.
Jeff Zaugg: Because our size, our volume, our first response is often the wrong tone. We talk about the "DadAwesome or Dad Angry." And there's no excuse. There's not ever with our little precious kids. I actually think I read this — that your dad never spoke to the rebellion or just like the things that you were missing. He didn't even speak to those.
Tim Timberlake: He called out the things that he knew were in me. And I always say this — in us we have both a fool and a king. As dads, as men, we both have a fool in us and a king. And the one that you address is the one that will respond.
Jeff Zaugg: Are we addressing ourselves or addressing our children?
Tim Timberlake: Either or. It does apply. Yeah.
Jeff Zaugg: So I'm raising little queens — or I can speak to the side of...
Tim Timberlake: That's right. And so you address them the way you want them to respond. And something that Jesus really challenged me on in my parenting — He said, "I don't just want you to respond like Me. I want you to react like Me." And so if we react like Jesus, then even when things kind of catch us off guard, or even when there are moments where your child drops the ball and they fumble and they mess up, your reaction is like Jesus and your heart is like Jesus. It reminds them that they are loved first, they are not what they have done, and there's still a place at the table for them. And that's a very beautiful place to be.
Jeff Zaugg: I think I also read that your dad told you "I love you" three times in that precious last conversation. And that you actually count with your son, Max.
Tim Timberlake: Yeah. I count because I know he's counting. And I know someday he's going to remember the last conversation we have and he's going to remember the last moments we have. And I want him to be aware of not just my love for him, but my dire need of his love for me. And so every single day before he closes his eyes, I tell him, "I love you. I love you. I love you."
Jeff Zaugg: Anchor that rest and the starting of the next day with three. Springboard. Love times three. I did read at some point — could this conversation stand as the last conversation? I say see you later to my girls and drive up here to have a conversation. Could that conversation stand as the last one? And if our tone and our responsiveness is from love, versus addressing the little queens, my wife the queen — versus a side that, of course, we have other sides that bubble up sometimes.
[OUTRO]
Jeff Zaugg: I am so thankful that you joined us for this first half of the conversation with Pastor Tim Timberlake. The conversation links, notes, transcripts, key takeaways — all are going to be found at dadawesome.org/podcast. And then simply jump to today's Episode 424. And sometimes the best thing you can do right now is open up your phone, go to that episode page and pray, "God, what was it from today's conversation that I can put into action?" We do not glorify God in heaven by having intent, feeling a feel, thinking "I'll maybe someday" — that does not glorify God. It's actually moving into practice, moving into action. So I'm praying that you guys are activated to be DadAwesome. Cheers for you guys. Have a great week.
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"Worship released peace. Worship flipped the environment of that space. It radically shifted things — worship."
"Getting uncomfortable going, serving — getting to new places often reveals new places of our hearts."
"We can stay in a comfort loop and continue to stay comfortable — or we can go."
"I'm dreaming about being a dad, starting a family. I loved hearing that answer from teenage young men."
"The marks from the world don't have to stick. Walk in freedom and know your true identity."
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